HOW OLD IS MY BICYCLE?

Site for pinarello serial number lookup? Aug 23, 12 13:30 Post #1 of 6 (15261 views). Also the ghosting of the original downtube decal has the word pinarello dead centre like the replacment, not either side like in the 85 brochure. Not sure if this varied in production though, other models in the 85 catalogue do have it dead centre. Serial number is MM695, does that give any indication? Pinarello serial number information for Z155. Laurenjaustin; Dec 18, 2018; 0 2K Dec 18, 2018. By laurenjaustin. Gan vs S vs RS, ride quality? Bing181; Oct 31, 2018.

‘How old is my bicycle?’ is a question I get asked a lot, nearly as much as: ‘I have a bicycle that looks like one of yours; if I send you pictures please can you identify it for me?’

The answer, in short, is that I do not have time to tell you either. I’m not being callous about this. With an estimated 15,000 bicycle manufacturers, the odds are stacked against me recognizing yours; in any case, I do not claim to be an expert, just an assiduous recorder of information. To sift through information to try and find similar pictures to your unidentified bicycle would take me months, and I’m already doing similar research on my own bikes. Not only do I have a full-time job (I run my own business restoring and selling vintage vehicles) and am a hands-on parent of a young child, but I spend a minimum 30 hours every week building, updating and maintaining these free websites to help you do your own research. My hobby usually takes a backseat. Insomnia is my saving grace, otherwise there would be no time for any of this.

My purpose for creating these databases is simple. In the ‘old days’ (a time which seems to have ended in the past twenty five years or so), a youngster became an apprentice in a chosen field and learned its history from the older employees. Thus, for example, an apprentice mechanic was handed down an invaluable unwritten guide to repairing vehicles that could not be learned at college nor from books, because, as well as specific information about various models, it helped a youngster understand the way they were designed and built.

Similarly, to learn about vintage bicycles, we ask questions of our elders in the hobby. The key point here is that the elders who were around while our favourite vintage machines were still on the road are no longer with us, the last of them having passed on in the past thirty years or so. Now we must depend on those who gleaned that first-hand knowledge from them; these chaps were the ‘youngsters’ then, but now they’re getting older themselves, most in their seventies and eighties. They don’t usually use computers, so much of their knowledge is stored in their heads. By the time we learn from them, it’s second-generation information. My contemporaries and I are in a younger age group – forties to sixties – and we’re busy learning and recording what we can before it’s lost forever. We study 100-year-old magazines to see when certain new innovations were first reviewed (it helps us date bicycles with similar features), read correspondence of the time to try to understand contemporary views and opinions, research old catalogues, meet fellow enthusiasts, help each other with restorations, ride our old bikes as much as possible, and work with our elders to pick up tips and wisdom.

If you can help in any way by contributing to this research, please get in touch. My email is embedded in the picture below.

By recording and sharing this knowledge while it’s still as fresh as possible, our fabulous vintage hobbies will continue for centuries to come.

TO FIND OUT HOW OLD YOUR BIKE IS – JOIN THE VETERAN CYCLE CLUB!

Although we are in the so-called ‘Information Age’ and the internet provides a surplus of it – some of it accurate, much of it misleading – there is nowhere near enough information on vintage bicycles. This surprises many people. Sometimes, folks with no experience of the vintage hobby who may have recently unearthed an old bicycle contact me and demand that I immediately tell them what it is, how old it is and what it’s worth. I try to explain as politely as possible that such a service does not exist, and they are often abusive as a result. Usually they want me to identify it so they can sell it on ebay. Luckily, I remembered an old Sufi saying, ‘Only explain things to people in a language they understand.’ So now I answer that such a service, which will obviously increase the value of their unidentified machine, will cost them £50 + VAT. It’s still not a service I actually offer – but at least they are less abusive.

The question remains: ‘How old is my bicycle?’ Also, ‘I have a bicycle that looks like one of yours; if I send you pictures please can you identify it for me?’

The answer is simple. The Veteran Cycle Club (V-CC) has a system of ‘marque enthusiasts’ – volunteers who compile what information they can about particular manufacturers. By joining the V-CC you can access whatever information is available. If that doesn’t help, if it is interesting enough, you might be able to send pictures of it to the the V-CC magazine, or take it to vintage shows and ask exhibitors, or keep an eye on ebay to see if something similar ever comes up. Identifying an unknown bicycle is hard work. You may be lucky, but more than likely it will remain a mystery.

As I have stated before, the V-CC archives and Ray Miller’s Encyclopaedia are invaluable resources: these ongoing projects are becoming the world’s primary source of information on vintage bicycles. The V-CC’s system of marque specialists is unrivalled throughout the world. I recommend every vintage bicycle enthusiast to join the V-CC to access these (and many other) excellent facilities.

FRAME NUMBER DATING

Bicycles that can be dated with 100% accuracy are the exception. Marque enthusiasts use records of shop ledgers that recorded dates sold and frame numbers, and then calculate the ages of other bicycles by comparing them with known frame numbers. Sometimes the date sold does not reflect when a bicycle was actually manufactured (for example, Dursley Pedersens were very expensive, badly marketed and often took a long time to sell). Only certain manufacturers’ frame number sequencing is known. Many did not use chronoligical sequences.

Many manufacturers used ‘bought-in’ bikes at different times, ie made by a different company. This happened in particular in the 1890s when frame styles changed every few years. Frames made by top companies with the old designs were sold off through the trade, so smaller companies then sold bicycles using the old frames with different parts years after!

The records of the majority of the smaller companies no longer exist: you’d be surprised how fast the entire history of a company disappears once the factory closes. There were also a lot of ‘dodgy practices’ within the bicycle trade, with companies regularly liquidating and starting up again and spurious production claims often made for advertising purposes and to inflate a company’s worth. Few published their true production figures. It’s a nightmare trying to make sense of it a hundred years later. Html editor for mac 10.4.

A catalogue description is a good guide, though we rarely have a manufacturer’s catalogue for every year, so may not know for how many years a model was current. Also, though we now consider a catalogue description to be an accurate guide to a bicycle’s specification, despite the catalogue options listed a customer could choose any option whatsoever, even components sold by a competing company.

It’s possible to date Sturmey-Archer hubs, so if the rear hub is original to the bike that often helps.

Bear in mind that owners often updated their bicycles over the years; though we might like our bike to match its catalogue description, updated parts are also a valid part of its history and provenance.

Details of the following manufacturers have been published, so I hope this page can provide an easy reference point. I’ll add to it as I find more.

RALEIGH FRAME NUMBER DATING

MY NOTES:

1.The Raleigh Heron Head transfer was introduced in 1908. In the same year, mudguards received a forward extension.

2. Raleigh’s ‘R’ lamp bracket was superseded in September 1927 by the heron lamp bracket (see below). The company had been taking steps to make it harder for makers of cheap bicycles to copy Raleigh parts. The ‘R’ bracket was easy to copy, so they introduced this more complex lamp bracket instead.

Consult the list below to help remember when these companies were still ‘original’ before being taken over by Raleigh:

Humber 1932

Triumph 1932

Rudge-Whitworth 1943

Three Spires 1954

BSA , New Hudson, Sunbeam 1957

Phillips 1960

Hercules 1960

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Pinarello Serial Number